The Service manual also makes certain assumptions
- You are a mechanic
- You already understand a bunch of "obvious" things
- You have every possible tool you need
- No bolts are rusted
- Etc...
Seeking Help - Trouble Starting
- Thread starter GTO-909
- Start date
Nenw
Well-Known Member
There are many good how-to's but they may require a deep dive into the forum in order to find them. I would say the largest benefit to this site would be a how-to thread. I assume these would need to be vetted by admin before being added, but could be sweet. But yeah, agreed.
Nenw
Well-Known Member
Let's break this down, shall we?
- You are a mechanic ---- If not now you will be after a year of ownership
- You already understand a bunch of "obvious" things ---- stop being so cynical
- You have every possible tool you need -----again, if not now you will have a pretty good collection with some time
- No bolts are rusted ---- isn't that part of the fun of owning one of these? I mean I love shearing the heads off of bolts almost every time I do a new repair.
- Etc... ---- yes lots of etcs.....
----But yes, point taken
Actually, as a 1½ year owner, I have become more of a mechanic, or at least more confident in my ability to get myself far too deep into a project to back out. But, I know there are still these odd gaps in my knowledge, tools, capabilities, skills, etc.Let's break this down, shall we?
- You are a mechanic ---- If not now you will be after a year of ownership
- You already understand a bunch of "obvious" things ---- stop being so cynical
Like
- Use a torch to heat a bolt to loosen a rusted bolt. (How long to heat? How hot to heat it to?)
- How to know that your brake pad replacement is solid, before rolling down the 10% 500ft long hill that ends at a T intersection into a busy road?
- How to know that your suspension needs replacement?
- And so on
So, that is what I was referring to. And As you said "Point taken" and point given gladly.
Let's all take a moment to be thankful that I didn't actually write the workshop manual; it's long enough as it is!
natematos
Well-Known Member
I'd take this one step further and have a "How-To" sub-forum here. Something where there is one topic per item and the top comment is a how-to-fix. Would make it easier to search against and clean up the cross-conversations that would happen if it was in a single thread.
Wildmtnchild
Member
I just want to add one point to the “not starting” differential diagnosis. The neutral safety switch. My Deli wouldn’t start one morning. No click, no turning over, nothing it was just dead. Ended up I didn’t have it all the way in park. Shifted into neutral and then back into park and voila! It started.
GTO-909
Member
UPDATE:
Not yet resolved... However:
Glow plug check completed... Glow plugs working.
Testing for fuel line near injectors... inconclusive. I am currently charging the battery as it was almost discharged completely.
I was not able to crank the engine very well with almost a dead battery. Previously, fuel present at fuel pump during hand pump test.
Solenoid still needs to be checked... I am not 100% sure of its location. If it is where I think it is; it is in a really tight spot.
More updates soon. For all who have been following this thread and have responded with some great and helpful information
please comment and let me know what you think.
I will follow up with another update soon.
Not yet resolved... However:
Glow plug check completed... Glow plugs working.
Testing for fuel line near injectors... inconclusive. I am currently charging the battery as it was almost discharged completely.
I was not able to crank the engine very well with almost a dead battery. Previously, fuel present at fuel pump during hand pump test.
Solenoid still needs to be checked... I am not 100% sure of its location. If it is where I think it is; it is in a really tight spot.
More updates soon. For all who have been following this thread and have responded with some great and helpful information
please comment and let me know what you think.
I will follow up with another update soon.
GTO-909
Member
I will have to try this out when my battery is fully charged. Thanks for participating in the thread. I would love for my problem to be as simple as that - kinda hoping that is all it is... I will be checking soon.
Any progress on getting a repair wiki?
Oh, and I updated my diesel Delica not starting checklist with some of the suggestions in this thread...
- Turn Key to start engine
- If engine starts, you're done! (Makes the Brmmm! noise)
- If engine turns over normally (Makes the Rrr-Rrr-Rrr noise) but doesn't start, then go to #14
- If engine doesn't turn over at all (Makes no noise at all), check your neutral safety switch on the transmission, by shifting into neutral, and then back into park
- If the engine still doesn’t start then the neutral safety switch might be faulty, or your battery may be low on voltage. So, check the battery voltage with a multimeter
- If the voltage is below 12-13v, then try using jumper cables and another battery to go back to #1 (Battery drained)
- If the voltage is above 12-13v, then measure voltage during cranking
- If the voltage while starting the engine drops below 9-10v then it's likely that you have a bad battery. Use jumper cables and go back to #1
- If the voltage doesn't drop at all while starting, then it's possible that you have a bad starter or starter relay
- Using jumper cables, connect to the positive on the battery, and touch the positive on the starter
- If the starter turns, then likely have a bad starter relay. Replace the starter relay.
- If the starter doesn't turn, then likely have a bad starter. Replace the starter.
- Do you hear a click noise when you turn the key to Run? This is the relay for your glow plugs turning on.
- If there is not a click, then go to #30
- If there is a click, then measure the voltage at the glow plugs with a multimeter .
- If the voltage of the glow plugs is 6v or 12v (depending on your type of engine/glow plug/controller) , does it turn off after 10-20 seconds?
- If voltage does not turn off after a "significant" amount of time. Then it's likely that your glow plug relay(s) or controller is stuck ON or have you have a faulty manual glow plug switch. Repair the problem and then test your glow plugs. You may have damaged them.
- If voltage does stop after the "right" amount of time, is it VERY cold outside?
- If very cold, then maybe you need to "boost" your glow plugs longer. If you have a manual glow plug switch hold it longer. If not, use a jumper cable to connect the glow plug rail to the battery for 10-12 seconds and then try to start.
- If not very cold, then you may have bad glow plugs or may not have fuel reaching the engine.
- Check the fuel level of tank, are you out of fuel?
- If you have fuel in your tank, then check for possible air in fuel lines.
- Loosen the bleed port nut on the the primer pump, and pump the pump until fuel comes out of the bleed port. Tighten the bleed port nut back up. Pump the pump a few more times until the pump gets “stiff” aka will not “squish” like it did with the bleed port open
- Now check the fuel at your injectors by using two wrenches to crack loose the fuel line heading into one injector. One wrench holds the injector, the other wrench loosens the fuel line. Turn the engine over for a few seconds to see if fuel dribbles out past the nut.
- If after a few seconds, you have fuel coming out of the fuel line at the injector, tighten the fuel line back up, and repeat #24 for each injector. If all injectors have fuel then go to #32
- If no fuel coming out of fuel lines fro the injectors after a few seconds of turning the engine over, check to see if the fuel shutoff solenoid has voltage with a multimeter
- If the fuel shutoff solenoid doesn't have +12V, try using a jumper lead to apply power directly to it from the battery
- If the engine then starts, you have a wiring fault (probably the rectangular connector on top of the IP, the wires get brittle and break internally)
- If the fuel shutoff solenoid has power but doesn't click, you'll need to remove the fuel shutoff solenoid. It has a rubber tip that can get jammed, or it might just be burnt out. Repair/replace the fuel shutoff solenoid.
- With a multimeter verify that you are are getting voltage to your glow plugs.
- If no voltage, use a jumper cable to connect the glow plug rail to the battery for 10-12 seconds then go back to #1
- If you have working starter, stater relay, glow plug voltage, fuel, and you still can't start. Then I have no clue, post a message to DelicaForum?
Nice.
#4 should include trying to start with the transmission in neutral as well.
#7 doesn't make sense to me; you're in the "doesn't crank" sequence.
#8 probably should mention that the voltage *will* drop to ~ 10v initially if glow plugs are energized.
#16 both glow systems apply 12v initially, the quick glow only switches to 6v after started. Quick glow should deactivate w/in ~ 5-6 sec...
I didn't see any mention of fuses/fusible links... inline fusible link on black/red powers glow plug & starter relays. IGN fusible link in the link box powers the ignition key (required to activate glow plug controller/relays/starter solenoid).
The large starter terminal should have 12v (straight from battery), the small spade terminal should have 12v when key is in start position (trans in park/neutral). If both are true then the starter/start solenoid is bad (replace starter).
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Good points...
- Need to add fuses/fusible links into this too... Haven't' had those issues yet. So don't know what to add...
- Great point on #4!
- Your comment on #7 makes sense. I had it in the voltage measuring bit, but you're right doesn't belong there.
- Likewise on #8.
- As for #16, I never knew that!
Over-voltage is what causes the 6v glow plugs to be "quick glow"... probably also causes a reduced life expectancy; especially when operated manually.As for #16, I never knew that!
BTW, I *think* that for the automatic, if the gear position inducator on the dash show the right position then the neutral safety switch and shift linkages are all probably OK. The manual trans also has a neutral safety as well, but no dash indicator.
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The
The neutral/park safety switch is in the same housing as the PRNDL lights switch (on the side of the transmission) so if the PRNDL lights work then the linkages are good.
However the safety switch is electrically separate to the lights switch: it can fail while the PRNDL lights still work.
The neutral/park safety switch is in the same housing as the PRNDL lights switch (on the side of the transmission) so if the PRNDL lights work then the linkages are good.
However the safety switch is electrically separate to the lights switch: it can fail while the PRNDL lights still work.
I was thinking a more general wiring/connector type fault; weird things are always possible... it's possible for the indicator to say it's in park when it really isn't.
@Kellyn Any update on whether we can get a Wiki for the forum and start putting some of our joint collective insanity into it?
GTO-909
Member
FOLLOW UP:
STILL NO PROGRESS, except learning a lot.
It appears my glow plugs are not functioning. Glow plug test with multimeter shows that nothing is functioning. I conclude that this is perhaps a reason that would keep my Deli from starting up. Does anyone have any advice?
Glow plugs were replaced.
Glow plug multi-meter test failure - no sign of glow plug function.
Everything connected and secured after replacing glow plugs and prior to multi-meter test.
STILL NO PROGRESS, except learning a lot.
It appears my glow plugs are not functioning. Glow plug test with multimeter shows that nothing is functioning. I conclude that this is perhaps a reason that would keep my Deli from starting up. Does anyone have any advice?
Glow plugs were replaced.
Glow plug multi-meter test failure - no sign of glow plug function.
Everything connected and secured after replacing glow plugs and prior to multi-meter test.